Author: vegetaboi4life
Date: Aug 12, 07 at 1:51am (PST)
Subject: re: Goku >>> Gohan (potential wise)
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quote NegativeEnergy
nope. gohan's mystic form is all of gohan's potential being drawn out at once. since gohan's potential is greater than goku's gohan is stronger than SSJ3 and unlike SSJ3, gohan's mystic form doesnt put any strain on him since he is in his base when he is using his mystic form. gohan is by far stronger than goku. like you said vegetaboi, SSJ3 is all the saiyan's potential drawn to the fullest (in goku's case) that is why GT is nothin but a huge filler in order for the series to keep going. gohan is much stronger than SSJ3 goku like i said because he has much greater potential than goku (DBZ wise)
Yes, that is exactly what I thought about the SSJ3 situation with gohan as well.
So I guess Mystic Gohan is the ultimate fighter technically.
But, filler wise, SSJ4 Goku would pwn him so much with just half his power. And I'm inclined to say half SSJ4 Goku's power is a little bit more than Buuhan.
And, imo Super Baby 2=Buuhan. So, pretty much, in GT, Mystic Gohan is obsolete to nearly all the enemies.
Author: NegativeEnergy
Date: Aug 12, 07 at 1:59am (PST)
Subject: re: Goku >>> Gohan (potential wise)
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yeah i know SSJ4 Goku would pwn mystic gohan but GT is a huge plothole and that SSJ3 is really the true final super saiyan transormation excluding GT. gohan's case however, hehas far greater potential than goku so
Mystic Gohan>>>SSJ3 Goku
Author: vegetaboi4life
Date: Aug 12, 07 at 2:30am (PST)
Subject: re: Goku >>> Gohan (potential wise)
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quote NegativeEnergy
yeah i know SSJ4 Goku would pwn mystic gohan but GT is a huge plothole and that SSJ3 is really the true final super saiyan transormation excluding GT. gohan's case however, hehas far greater potential than goku so
Mystic Gohan>>>SSJ3 Goku
Heh, more like Mystic gohan>>>>>>>SSJ3 Goku lol.
Super Buu>>>>SSJ3 Goku. SSJ Gotenks>>SSJ3 Goku. Omg so many people pwn SSJ3 Goku.
But, in GT, Gohan is nothing to goku.
Author: NegativeEnergy
Date: Aug 12, 07 at 2:45am (PST)
Subject: re: Goku >>> Gohan (potential wise)
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ya that is why i kind of hate GT cause of the plotholes (off topic:i thank Gt for seven dragons saga) but it ismore like this (and i am not putting arrows for how much stronger, just that i know they are stronger so dont go SSJ3 goku>>>>>>>Mystic gohan just one arrow i am putting)
Mystic Gohan>Super Buu=SSJ3 Gotenks>SSJ3 Goku.
but that is DBZ. in GT of course, vegeta and goku are the 2 best z warriors and have far more potential than gohan from their tails allowing for SSJ4 (a plothole transformation that is so-called the "ultimate transformation")
Author: SSJ2_Gohan
Date: Aug 12, 07 at 8:10am (PST)
Subject: re: Goku >>> Gohan (potential wise)
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Lol tons of people own SSJ3 Goku he never did much good except for filler movie 13... I can't believe people who think he's stronger than mystic gohan...
Author: G_O_G_E_T_A
Date: Aug 12, 07 at 9:00am (PST)
Subject: re: Goku >>> Gohan (potential wise)
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quote NegativeEnergy
ya that is why i kind of hate GT cause of the plotholes (off topic:i thank Gt for seven dragons saga) but it ismore like this (and i am not putting arrows for how much stronger, just that i know they are stronger so dont go SSJ3 goku>>>>>>>Mystic gohan just one arrow i am putting)
Mystic Gohan>Super Buu=SSJ3 Gotenks>SSJ3 Goku.
but that is DBZ. in GT of course, vegeta and goku are the 2 best z warriors and have far more potential than gohan from their tails allowing for SSJ4 (a plothole transformation that is so-called the "ultimate transformation")
Completely right here. Chou Gohan is the strongest unfused, canon character. Dragonball GT has SSJ 4, I always consider SSJ 4 as beeing hidden potential coming from the Saiyan's tails, which no one was aware of in DBZ.
Or you can say it's nonsense because in DBZ, SSJ 3 was stated to be the ultimate Saiyan form and GT came up with SSJ 4. If you add everything together as a whole, Gohan's potential is higher in DBZ, and Goku and Vegeta's is higher in GT thanks to SSJ 4.
As for movie 13, I don't care if it's hypocrisy on my part or not, but Goku was clearly supposed to win that fight and nobody else, not even people who have been proven stronger than him in the DBZ canon. I don't know why, but Toei seems to be very fond of Goku, he kills practically every villain in the movies and GT.
Author: SSJ2_Gohan
Date: Aug 12, 07 at 6:15pm (PST)
Subject: re: Goku >>> Gohan (potential wise)
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Yup Goku is their poster boy. They loooooove him.
Author: punchout88
Date: Aug 13, 07 at 12:38am (PST)
Subject: re: Goku >>> Gohan (potential wise)
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quote vegetaboi4life
quote ssj4 Tolu
ok forget about ssj4. Still vegeta couldnt reach ssj3 because it can only be reached by training and thats how goku reached it in other world. Believe me thats how it is... But this is going off topic so its better to go back on topic
Ok agreed we'll get back to the topic.
quoteSorry to stop this denate (that could be continued on a few hundred other off topic threads around here) But...
Alright, agreed. Back to the topic. So, do you think if gohan ever reached SSJ3 his potential would be even greater than it is with his mystic form?
I say they'be be equle, because a half saiyan's potential is ssj3, and Mystic Gohan is all his potential, meaning mystic Gohan= Peak of ssj3 Gohan. But since ssj3 would drain him, he's better off with mystic.
Author: G_O_G_E_T_A
Date: Aug 13, 07 at 8:56am (PST)
Subject: re: Goku >>> Gohan (potential wise)
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That is true, it's stated that in DBZ, the Saiyan's full potential is unlocked as a Super Saiyan 3. Which means that Gohan, had he reached SSJ 3, would have the same powerlevel as Chou Gohan.
Author: Broly The LSSJ
Date: Aug 13, 07 at 9:35am (PST)
Subject: re: Goku >>> Gohan (potential wise)
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quoteAs for movie 13, I don't care if it's hypocrisy on my part or not, but Goku was clearly supposed to win that fight and nobody else, not even people who have been proven stronger than him in the DBZ canon. I don't know why, but Toei seems to be very fond of Goku, he kills practically every villain in the movies and GT.
Well Movie 13 took place one year after the Kid Buu Saga and for that time, Gohan slacked while Goku kept training so his Max Powered SSJ3 > Gohan who I would assume is still Mystic because hes wearing the same clothes yet hes weaker.
SSJ3 GT Goku is also stronger than Mystic Gohan.
I know what you mean though. Piccolo should've won in Movie 7 because he was a Super Namek at the time and the SSJ's never went into the Time Chamber yet meaning he was alot stronger.
Author: adamrpg
Date: Aug 13, 07 at 10:59am (PST)
Subject: re: Goku >>> Gohan (potential wise)
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ok,and for the people out there that think Mystic is a transformation,your wrong.at some point,old kai told gohan not to go SSJ because his "Mystic"powers would destroy the earth.I don't want to bother looking up a quote.And finally someone agrees with me about Piccolo>the ssjs before training in the HBTC.
Author: G_O_G_E_T_A
Date: Aug 13, 07 at 11:14am (PST)
Subject: re: Goku >>> Gohan (potential wise)
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quoteWell Movie 13 took place one year after the Kid Buu Saga and for that time, Gohan slacked while Goku kept training so his Max Powered SSJ3 > Gohan who I would assume is still Mystic because hes wearing the same clothes yet hes weaker.
SSJ3 GT Goku is also stronger than Mystic Gohan.
Gohan was indeed still using his "Mystic" form in movie 13. Which is also the reason why he had the exact same power as he had against Majin Buu. He is at his absolute full power in that state, which can be determined from his Japanese name which is "Chou Gohan", which translated, means "Full Power Gohan".
About the whole Goku beeing stronger issue, you know my view point there, I don't buy it. In Dragonball GT it's acceptable to say that Goku is indeed stronger, due to all those years of training.
quoteI know what you mean though. Piccolo should've won in Movie 7 because he was a Super Namek at the time and the SSJ's never went into the Time Chamber yet meaning he was alot stronger.
Goku was obviously supposed to destroy that big bad android with an instant killer move, which he of course has in the form of the Spirit Bomb. But yeah, Piccolo's powerlevel at that time was greater than that of any of the Super Saiyans.
quoteok,and for the people out there that think Mystic is a transformation,your wrong.at some point,old kai told gohan not to go SSJ because his "Mystic"powers would destroy the earth
Gohan's ability to go SSJ was completely taken away from him when he was powered up by the Elder Kai. Mystic is Gohan's full power unlocked in his base form.
Author: SSJ4BROLY
Date: Aug 13, 07 at 11:44am (PST)
Subject: re: Goku >>> Gohan (potential wise)
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quote BrolytheLSSJ
quoteAs for movie 13, I don't care if it's hypocrisy on my part or not, but Goku was clearly supposed to win that fight and nobody else, not even people who have been proven stronger than him in the DBZ canon. I don't know why, but Toei seems to be very fond of Goku, he kills practically every villain in the movies and GT.
Well Movie 13 took place one year after the Kid Buu Saga and for that time, Gohan slacked while Goku kept training so his Max Powered SSJ3 > Gohan who I would assume is still Mystic because hes wearing the same clothes yet hes weaker.
SSJ3 GT Goku is also stronger than Mystic Gohan.
well like G_O_G_E_T_A said goku is destined to win that movie just like the broly movie, gohan was meant to be the strongest yet he didnt last that long, goku was meant to win in movie 8 and he was also meant to win movie 13
Author: Broly The LSSJ
Date: Aug 13, 07 at 12:17pm (PST)
Subject: re: Goku >>> Gohan (potential wise)
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quoteGohan was indeed still using his "Mystic" form in movie 13. Which is also the reason why he had the exact same power as he had against Majin Buu. He is at his absolute full power in that state, which can be determined from his Japanese name which is "Chou Gohan", which translated, means "Full Power Gohan".
Makes sense but maybe it can be that only Goku's Super Dragon Fist is what made him stronger. I'll have to read into it a bit more but lets not forget, Gohan was hit twice by Final Form Hirudegarn and knocked out whereas Max Powered SSJ3 Goku took two hits and was "still standing"
quoteGoku was obviously supposed to destroy that big bad android with an instant killer move, which he of course has in the form of the Spirit Bomb. But yeah, Piccolo's powerlevel at that time was greater than that of any of the Super Saiyans.
Its too bad he never used the power he got from fusing with Kami in that movie. Otherwise, he'd be tearing it up more. The Super Spirit Bomb isn't even all of Goku's power but yeah, hes the hero so he wins in almost every movie.
quoteGohan's ability to go SSJ was completely taken away from him when he was powered up by the Elder Kai. Mystic is Gohan's full power unlocked in his base form.
Yeah, when I was little I used to think he could go SSJ from this form and be a hell of a lot stronger but just didn't need to. This came from Piccolo saying "hes not even a SSJ" but he didn't know that was already Gohan's full power apparently.
quoteAnd finally someone agrees with me about Piccolo>the ssjs before training in the HBTC.
Yep, people should know that.
Author: G_O_G_E_T_A
Date: Aug 13, 07 at 12:30pm (PST)
Subject: re: Goku >>> Gohan (potential wise)
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quoteMakes sense but maybe it can be that only Goku's Super Dragon Fist is what made him stronger. I'll have to read into it a bit more but lets not forget, Gohan was hit twice by Final Form Hirudegarn and knocked out whereas Max Powered SSJ3 Goku took two hits and was "still standing"
And that is the part that I find disputable, the fact that Goku was able to withstand Hirudegarn's attacks is weird. He did have to put all of his effort in to block 'em though. And if I recall correctly, Gohan was struck in the back. It is without doubt that the Dragonfist is far stronger than Ultimate Gohan indeed.
Heck, in GT it was strong enough to allow base Goku to defeat Super 17, who smashed SSJ 4 Goku.
quoteIts too bad he never used the power he got from fusing with Kami in that movie. Otherwise, he'd be tearing it up more. The Super Spirit Bomb isn't even all of Goku's power but yeah, hes the hero so he wins in almost every movie.
Although I find it to be a shame, that's indeed what it comes down to, Goku is the hero. Although in DBZ, Vegeta, Gohan, Piccolo and even Goten and Trunks got the chance to shine at times. But in the movies, and certainly GT, it was all Goku.
quoteYeah, when I was little I used to think he could go SSJ from this form and be a hell of a lot stronger but just didn't need to. This came from Piccolo saying "hes not even a SSJ" but he didn't know that was already Gohan's full power apparently.
Even if by some chance he could go SSJ, he wouldn't get stronger at all. Gohan was fighting in his base form and beating the crap out of Super Buu, I guess that's what stunned Piccolo so much, the fact that Gohan didn't even have to transform to trash Buu.
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