Neoseeker.com Forum Thread: I am sick of Gogeta nerfers - page 1

reprinted from http://www.neoseeker.com/forums/
original thread: http://www.neoseeker.com/forums/88/t1817051-am-sick-of-gogeta-nerfers/


Author:   Slayerslice
Date:   Jan 12, 13 at 1:41am (PST)
Subject:   I am sick of Gogeta nerfers
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It's so dumb seeing people nerf Gogeta and treat him the same as the gap between Goku/Vegeta to Goten/Trunks, it doesn't work that way, we have seen Post Gotenks (Base) surpassing Pre (SSJ) with minimal training was that gap between Pre and Post the same between Pre Goten and Post Goten? NO!

The gap between Adults and Kids is still gigantic, moreso then the kids gained in Rosat.
Should Gogeta be treated much stronger then Gotenks? Definately, no doubt about it.

And I have seen people throw this argument way too much, Would Goku SSJ beat Goten SSJ3?
That's so bs, does Goten Pre-SSJ beat Post-Base Goten? YES!

Stop nerfing Gogeta, he is above Ultimate Gohan in his SSJ easily.

And people love to throw this Buuhan argument aswell, Buuhan says that the fusion won't be enough, yeah sure that's why he doesn't want them to fuse right? Buuhan is scared, and Vegito contradicted his statements by owning him when Buuhan says he's stronger.

Buuhan is either full of shit or his statements are induced by fear.

/End Rant





Author:   Blockinlick
Date:   Jan 12, 13 at 5:03am (PST)
Subject:   re: I am sick of Gogeta nerfers
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quote Slayerslice
It's so dumb seeing people nerf Gogeta and treat him the same as the gap between Goku/Vegeta to Goten/Trunks, it doesn't work that way, we have seen Post Gotenks (Base) surpassing Pre (SSJ) with minimal training was that gap between Pre and Post the same between Pre Goten and Post Goten? NO!

The gap between Adults and Kids is still gigantic, moreso then the kids gained in Rosat.
Should Gogeta be treated much stronger then Gotenks? Definately, no doubt about it.

And I have seen people throw this argument way too much, Would Goku SSJ beat Goten SSJ3?
That's so bs, does Goten Pre-SSJ beat Post-Base Goten? YES!

Stop nerfing Gogeta, he is above Ultimate Gohan in his SSJ easily.

And people love to throw this Buuhan argument aswell, Buuhan says that the fusion won't be enough, yeah sure that's why he doesn't want them to fuse right? Buuhan is scared, and Vegito contradicted his statements by owning him when Buuhan says he's stronger.

Buuhan is either full of shit or his statements are induced by fear.

/End Rant


Honestly, the problem doesn't end there either, because part of the problem is that Ultimate Gohan is overrated. Some people here think that UG is as strong or stronger than Gohan SSJ4... as if to just blindly assume that "to the max" means their absolute maximum and not their "current maximum".

I think this little theory here;
http://www.neoseeker.com/forums/88/t1810959-dormant-power-hidden-power/

Is pretty dead on, in my opinion. I don't think The Elder Kai's ritual put Gohan to his absolute potential... I think it maxed out his "current potential" based on his "current talents"... not make him as strong as he could have ever possibly been. That being said, SSJ3 Gohan is a better comparison... but SSJ4, that's a joke. Based on how well Gohan fought Buu, I doubt anything SSJ4 strong would have fought like that. I mean, he did tear Buu up, but it wasn't flawless like it should have been. It wasn't a landslide like SSJ Vegito Vs Buu... so it's definitely more sensible to compare it to SSJ3.

As for directly relating your post, I don't know how to feel about Gogetas power. GT's power scale just goes apeshit to a point where it's too tedious to even try to make sense of it. All I'm saying is, Gogeta is probably stronger than UG.



Author:   Slayerslice
Date:   Jan 12, 13 at 6:37am (PST)
Subject:   re: I am sick of Gogeta nerfers
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If I had to envision a fight between SSJ Gotenks and SSJ Gogeta, it would go like this.
SSJ Gotenks flying upto Gogeta punching and kicking Gogeta, Gogeta just standing there like a solid rock not budging from any of his strikes, then boom 1-kick through the mountains and SSJ Post Gotenks is split in half knocking both kids out.

And SSJ Gogeta vs. Super Buu, Super Buu is fodder for Gogeta, Super Buu will try and hit Gogeta, but Gogeta is dodging everything like Broly did against Piccolo and Goku on that mountain, 1 kick and he stretches Super Buu's neck out, a few punches into Big Bang Kamehameha incinerating Super Buu.

Gogeta is a god compared all the villains in DBZ, second to Vegito.
Gogeta is so strong because of Goku and Vegeta, that's why Kibitoshin is not a god like Gogeta, even using his Potara.



Author:   Blade007
Date:   Jan 12, 13 at 6:42am (PST)
Subject:   re: I am sick of Gogeta nerfers
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SSjin Gogeta ~ Mystic Gohan IMO and I agree people are fools for saying SSjin 3 Goten > SSjin Goku. That's not how it works.



Author:   Slayerslice
Date:   Jan 12, 13 at 6:44am (PST)
Subject:   re: I am sick of Gogeta nerfers
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quote Blade007
SSjin Gogeta ~ Mystic Gohan IMO and I agree people are fools for saying SSjin 3 Goten > SSjin Goku. That's not how it works.
Nah SSjin Gogeta > Mystic Gohan, Goku knew he can beat Buutenks by fusing with Gohan (Fusion dance).
The only way Gohan can fuse with Goku is if he drops down to Goku's level which is the same as Vegeta.
So a Gokuhan is as strong as Gogeta.



Author:   Blade007
Date:   Jan 12, 13 at 6:55am (PST)
Subject:   re: I am sick of Gogeta nerfers
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quote Slayerslice
quote Blade007
SSjin Gogeta ~ Mystic Gohan IMO and I agree people are fools for saying SSjin 3 Goten > SSjin Goku. That's not how it works.
Nah SSjin Gogeta > Mystic Gohan, Goku knew he can beat Buutenks by fusing with Gohan (Fusion dance).
The only way Gohan can fuse with Goku is if he drops down to Goku's level which is the same as Vegeta.
So a Gokuhan is as strong as Gogeta.
That doesn't mean the power would be the same when you are fused.



Author:   Slayerslice
Date:   Jan 12, 13 at 6:58am (PST)
Subject:   re: I am sick of Gogeta nerfers
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quote Blade007
quote Slayerslice
quote Blade007
SSjin Gogeta ~ Mystic Gohan IMO and I agree people are fools for saying SSjin 3 Goten > SSjin Goku. That's not how it works.
Nah SSjin Gogeta > Mystic Gohan, Goku knew he can beat Buutenks by fusing with Gohan (Fusion dance).
The only way Gohan can fuse with Goku is if he drops down to Goku's level which is the same as Vegeta.
So a Gokuhan is as strong as Gogeta.
That doesn't mean the power would be the same when you are fused.
Why not? It's the same PL but different people.
You can check where Goku and Old Kai were watching that crystal ball and he said he can fuse with Gohan to beat Buutenks.



Author:   Blade007
Date:   Jan 12, 13 at 7:00am (PST)
Subject:   re: I am sick of Gogeta nerfers
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quote Slayerslice
quote Blade007
quote Slayerslice
quote Blade007
SSjin Gogeta ~ Mystic Gohan IMO and I agree people are fools for saying SSjin 3 Goten > SSjin Goku. That's not how it works.
Nah SSjin Gogeta > Mystic Gohan, Goku knew he can beat Buutenks by fusing with Gohan (Fusion dance).
The only way Gohan can fuse with Goku is if he drops down to Goku's level which is the same as Vegeta.
So a Gokuhan is as strong as Gogeta.
That doesn't mean the power would be the same when you are fused.
Why not? It's the same PL but different people.
You can check where Goku and Old Kai were watching that crystal ball and he said he can fuse with Gohan to beat Buutenks.
Gohan can lower his power but the power would not be lowered after fusing.



Author:   Slayerslice
Date:   Jan 12, 13 at 7:03am (PST)
Subject:   re: I am sick of Gogeta nerfers
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quote Blade007
quote Slayerslice
quote Blade007
quote Slayerslice
quote Blade007
SSjin Gogeta ~ Mystic Gohan IMO and I agree people are fools for saying SSjin 3 Goten > SSjin Goku. That's not how it works.
Nah SSjin Gogeta > Mystic Gohan, Goku knew he can beat Buutenks by fusing with Gohan (Fusion dance).
The only way Gohan can fuse with Goku is if he drops down to Goku's level which is the same as Vegeta.
So a Gokuhan is as strong as Gogeta.
That doesn't mean the power would be the same when you are fused.
Why not? It's the same PL but different people.
You can check where Goku and Old Kai were watching that crystal ball and he said he can fuse with Gohan to beat Buutenks.
Gohan can lower his power but the power would not be lowered after fusing.
Gohan's power becomes irrelevant when they fuse though, they are no longer a seperate being.
The PL is fixed when they fuse, it's not like Gohan's side can power up.



Author:   G_O_G_E_T_A
Date:   Jan 13, 13 at 10:47am (PST)
Subject:   re: I am sick of Gogeta nerfers
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quote Slayerslice
And people love to throw this Buuhan argument aswell, Buuhan says that the fusion won't be enough, yeah sure that's why he doesn't want them to fuse right? Buuhan is scared, and Vegito contradicted his statements by owning him when Buuhan says he's stronger.

Buuhan is either full of shit or his statements are induced by fear.
That Buuhan comment shouldn't even be taken seriously either as Buuhan had no knowledge whatsoever about a possible rival's boost occurring. Perhaps if Gogeta was just Goku + Vegeta x the Metamorian fusion boost (whatever that may be), he would have been stronger, but I have good reason to think that Gogeta is a good chunk more than that. He's most definitely well above Ultimate Gohan as far as I'm concerned.

I have to say that Vegito is superior to Gogeta, but I agree that some of the estimations I see are flat out laughable and ridiculous (and not in a good way).



Author:   XxSkelterXx
Date:   Jan 13, 13 at 1:20pm (PST)
Subject:   re: I am sick of Gogeta nerfers
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I think the most ridiculous shit I've seen is the base Vegetto>> Super saiyan 3 Gogeta crap...I've also heard that the only incarnation of Gogeta that could hope to beat the unaltered Super Boo would be Super Saiyan 3 Gogeta..lots of folks at Shinden follow this shit.



Author:   Blade007
Date:   Jan 13, 13 at 1:36pm (PST)
Subject:   re: I am sick of Gogeta nerfers
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quote XxSkelterXx
I think the most ridiculous shit I've seen is the base Vegetto>> Super saiyan 3 Gogeta crap...I've also heard that the only incarnation of Gogeta that could hope to beat the unaltered Super Boo would be Super Saiyan 3 Gogeta..lots of folks at Shinden follow this shit.
Fools from DBZF follow it and Shinden is based on it. The simple fact that they think SSjin 3 Gogeta ~ Ultimate Gohan is just LOL. SSjin Gogeta ~ Ultimate Gohan might be sensible.



Author:   metal4ever
Date:   Jan 13, 13 at 2:08pm (PST)
Subject:   re: I am sick of Gogeta nerfers
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So where's this awesome proof that makes Gogeta out to be so strong?



Author:   Slayerslice
Date:   Jan 13, 13 at 3:10pm (PST)
Subject:   re: I am sick of Gogeta nerfers
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quote metal4ever
So where's this awesome proof that makes Gogeta out to be so strong?
Base Gotenks Post >> Pre SSJ Gotenks, how big is that gap between those 2?
How big is the gap between Kids Pre and Post? Definately not the same, even then they didn't gain much, and it was expected from Piccolo that a slight increase for the kids is a huge increase for Gotenks.

Now look at the gap between Goku and Goten, that's much bigger then what Goten gained in Rosat.
I'd say Goten Pre is 85, Post 100, Goku 200.

Imagine a 15% increase for Goten increases that much for Gotenks, let alone a whole 115%?
Yeah, Gogeta is awesome.

What about the fusion request with Vegeta inside Buu? Or when Goku wanted to go to Earth to fuse with Ultimate Gohan with the fusion dance? The only way Gohan is going to fuse with Goku is if he drops down to Goku's level, who is basically Vegeta, so Vegeta = Gohan if they fuse with Goku.

Or what about the statement that Old Kai was complimenting the fusee's and not the Potara's that Vegito is so strong, it's because they are the masters of the universe and it's logical that they'd be so strong.

It's funny how Buuhan allowed Goku to fuse with anyone that was there, but they were all doo doo.
Ko'd Tien, Hercule and Dende. But when Goku actually finds Vegeta, Buuhan tries to sabotage this fusion but allowed Goku to fuse with the other ones? Lol.



Author:   metal4ever
Date:   Jan 13, 13 at 6:45pm (PST)
Subject:   re: I am sick of Gogeta nerfers
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quote Slayerslice
Base Gotenks Post >> Pre SSJ Gotenks, how big is that gap between those 2?
How big is the gap between Kids Pre and Post? Definately not the same, even then they didn't gain much, and it was expected from Piccolo that a slight increase for the kids is a huge increase for Gotenks.

Now look at the gap between Goku and Goten, that's much bigger then what Goten gained in Rosat.
I'd say Goten Pre is 85, Post 100, Goku 200.

Imagine a 15% increase for Goten increases that much for Gotenks, let alone a whole 115%?
Yeah, Gogeta is awesome.
Think about this for a second. It's obvious Fusions are only as strong as they need to be to satisfy the story. If a fighter only needs to get 15% stronger to make their Fusion's base surpass their previous Fusion's Super Saiyan, then a "30% stronger" Gotenks, Gogeta and Gokan should all be able to one-shot base Boohan in their base form. That's not so though because Goku thought he'd need Super Saiyan as Fusion Gokan to defeat Bootenks. In their world Fusion can be predicted and such but in ours it cannot because we don't control the story.

quote Slayerslice
What about the fusion request with Vegeta inside Buu? Or when Goku wanted to go to Earth to fuse with Ultimate Gohan with the fusion dance? The only way Gohan is going to fuse with Goku is if he drops down to Goku's level, who is basically Vegeta, so Vegeta = Gohan if they fuse with Goku.
What about the Fusion request? Goku didn't mention which form of Gogeta would fight Bootenks.

Those are made up rules. Fusions that include a far stronger fighter may create a stronger Fusion.

quote Slayerslice
Or what about the statement that Old Kai was complimenting the fusee's and not the Potara's that Vegito is so strong, it's because they are the masters of the universe and it's logical that they'd be so strong.
Elder Kaioshin basically said stronger fighters = stronger Fusions, which is obvious. Elder Kaioshin did compliment the Potara when he explained a Potara Fusion > Metamorphian Fusion.

quote Slayerslice
It's funny how Buuhan allowed Goku to fuse with anyone that was there, but they were all doo doo.

Ko'd Tien, Hercule and Dende. But when Goku actually finds Vegeta, Buuhan tries to sabotage this fusion but allowed Goku to fuse with the other ones? Lol.
Boohan was getting impatient and gave Goku to the count of five. Goku ran out of time and so chased after him to kill him. He thought he could handle Gogeta but would rather end it now. Of course I think he was being cocky but not as clouded as you think he is.


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