re: 3 odd facts - Page 11 - Loungin'

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Another_Mutant aka the Evil Storyteller true seeker (2K Remix) total posts: 2161 since: Aug 2002	Jul 22, 04 at 12:21am ^ re: 3 odd facts
	Log in to remove this advertisement quote Koloth quote You can prove that you exist. can I? Or am I just a figment of your imagination? I have no proof of my exsistence. Admittedly I am assuming that you will find this proof when you look. Of course, I might be imagining you in which case you will be unable to find proof. Finding proof of your own existence is doable (although even there your own existence may not be what you believe it to be). Other people may be hallucinations. <merge> quote Koloth Thus far there is no evidence to put the occurances of WW2 in question. Look at the definition of proof again: quote Proof The evidence or argument that compels the mind to accept an assertion as true. The validation of a proposition by application of specified rules, as of induction or deduction, to assumptions, axioms, and sequentially derived conclusions. A statement or argument used in such a validation. Convincing or persuasive demonstration: was asked for proof of his identity; an employment history that was proof of her dependability. that compels the mind to accept an assertion as true Hmmm isn't that what I said? Who is foolish now? Here we come to absolute proof vs beyond a reasonable doubt proof vs preponderance of evidence proof. On the original post, 1 appears to use the absolute standard. 2 appears to use a different standard. This message was edited by Another_Mutant on Jul 21 2004.
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Morning Dreamer Resident Neo total posts: 2591 since: Sep 2001	Jul 22, 04 at 4:27am ^ re: 3 odd facts
	quote No I never said that. In fact 100% certainity is virtualy impossible under normal circumstances. But please provide me one thing that is 100% certainly known as absolute fact. I bet I could just as quickly debunk just about any arguement. Even reality is questionable. Metaphysics is constantly arguing questions of accepted reality. First off, what proof and evidence DO have in common is that they are both mechanis f displayment. In other words, their the displacment of informatin for the comperhention of the person, weather the person regcognises them or not. It's the act of displacment that defines them. Evidence is simply things thatadd up and make sense. Nothing more. Fact is hands down, solid, uncnditional reality. As I mentioned before, all things past and preasent are fact, it's weather not they can be displayed as fact. The vary concept that you have a mind and life in you is enough to display to your self that it is a 100% fact that you exist, althugh you have no way of displaying that before me. To have 100% fact that the world exists is as simple as to just look around, although this will not nessasarally prove what this world is, only that by some dimention, weather what we commnley think of it, your own mind created world or what ever, it does exist. If you want to disprove anyfacts, try the 3 odd factsin the rigional post of this thread.
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Fyrestorm Charged With Sexual Battery (moderator) Neo Emcee's Open Mic Neo-Duelist League The Arena The Graveyard The Legacy total posts: 12145 since: Sep 2003	Jul 22, 04 at 9:18am ^ re: 3 odd facts
	quote Koloth I have not gone off topic. If I have please point to where it was. quote which is by far the most foolish thing you have said so far, when you gather enough proof it must be true, do you even think before you type this? However you statement is a matter of opinion. Cops gather evidence they use to determine what happened in a crime. When they have enough they make an arrest based on the given conclusion. The only reason appeals can and do occur is because the evidence is put in doubt or new evidence comes into question. Thus far there is no evidence to put the occurances of WW2 in question. Look at the definition of proof again: quote Proof The evidence or argument that compels the mind to accept an assertion as true. The validation of a proposition by application of specified rules, as of induction or deduction, to assumptions, axioms, and sequentially derived conclusions. A statement or argument used in such a validation. Convincing or persuasive demonstration: was asked for proof of his identity; an employment history that was proof of her dependability. that compels the mind to accept an assertion as true Hmmm isn't that what I said? Who is foolish now? You seem incapable to get over this simple hurdle, my statement that you refer to is not opinion but fact, and that is where you are failing to progress past. You say such and such about how cops make arrests and then in the face of new evidence things are changed, which is simply agreeing with our point that Absolute proof cannot be achieved in reality. Thus all this talk you make about proof is off-topic, since the topic is Absolute proof, not conventional. Further more you keep referring to the definition of Proof like it is even relevant, which it is not. Since you seem to like quoting the dictionary so much, here is one for you: quote Validate: 1. To declare or make legally valid. 2. To mark with an indication of official sanction. 3. To establish the soundness of; corroborate. See Synonyms at confirm. That is what proof is, something which has been declared likely to be true, to establish the soundness of. Absolute proof would go beyond this by being beyond any form of challenge, it does not matter that WWII has not been called into question, if you are able to think outside the small box you may realise that it could be, and that is the point. I am alive, should I assume that this makes me immortal, since nothing has proven itself capable of killing me? No, I think I'll be reasonable and think I'm mortal, but I do not claim to be able to prove beyond any doubt either case, and yes one's death can be faked to great professionalism. So we recognise that WWII cannot be proven beyond all doubt, thus it cannot be Absolutely proven, thus our point stands. You are repeating yourself and getting nowhere. ------------------- Words Are Weapons
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udontneed2knowme Resident Neo total posts: 3120 since: Jun 2004	Jul 28, 04 at 2:17am ^ re: 3 odd facts
	"The very fact that anything in existance functions at all, is proof of A minimum entity = molaquils" I believe you meant molecules.. at first, I was like "what the heck are molaquils?" Regardless of some misspelled words, I'm able to understand what you and alot of people on the Internet are writing. I'm not going to start criticizing about that (as if it would change anything.. of course not).. I want to get to more important points in my post. For a long time now, especially in the past few years, followed my belief system in a similiar if not exact way that Morning Dreamer does. FACTS through research and confirming before I believe anything, and I've expressed it in a few threads. Some people never seem to "get" it.. I hate the stupidity. They don't separate BELIEFS (something you usually WANT to believe) from FACTS (something you HAVE to believe, like it or not simply because there's enough proof to reach a conclusion, unless somehow it becomes disproved which would no longer be a fact). As for the difference between EVIDENCE and FACTS.. evidence is something to SUGGEST and SUPPORT a POSSIBILITY, but NOT A FACT ITSELF. NOTHING IS A FACT WITHOUT PROVEN CONCLUSION. Unfortunately, there are alot of facts that can never be proven outside our own experience.. for example, that I did smoke weed or have those nasty bike incidents I recall, but it can't be proven to anyone that hasn't witnessed them. Unfortunately, many people like my mom is an idiot who will never seem to understand this stuff.. once she believes something, nothing seems to shake it from her (like religion). That's why she never listens to me.. STUBBORN. She would say the same of me, but at least I would rather be stubbornly CORRECT. She lacks humility because her pride is more important to her.. never admits she's wrong, even if she knows it. I SEE IT and know because she NEVER apologizes. I listen to what she has to say but she never listens to me.. she gets ironic and/or gets off topic, then says "I don't want to talk about it any more". ANYTHING TO AVOID THE TRUTH.. IT'S LIKE THAT EVERY SINGLE bleepIN' TIME..I HATE IT. If you ever want to know the truth, you HAVE to let go of your pride first.. confidence is one thing, arrogance and delusion is another. What I hate most is when people like her don't understand it doesn't matter who was right or wrong, and bitching/asking about trivial things or things you can't change/control (e.g. the past).. THEY DON'T GET THE BIG PICTURE. A SOLUTION IS ALL THAT MATTERS, NOT WHO WAS RIGHT OR WRONG.. AND YOU NEED TO COMPROMISE TO ACCOMPLISH THAT, OR IN SOME WAY UNDERSTAND THE SAME THING. THE PROBLEM IS WHEN PEOPLE JUST WANT THINGS THEIR WAY. THAT'S HER bleepIN' PROBLEM.. SELFISH AND EGOCENTRIC.. to her, it's always about what SHE WANTS, HOW SHE WANTS, and WHEN SHE WANTS IT.. but the other way around? SHE DOESN'T GIVE A bleep.. EITHER THAT OR SHE DOESN'T "GET" IT. I'm not simply venting.. I'm hoping it sheds light on any dim-witted IGNORANT people. I don't believe anything for the sake of arrogance.. I care about truth. This message was edited by udontneed2knowme on Jul 27 2004.[b][/b][i][/i] This message was edited by udontneed2knowme on Jul 27 2004. This message was edited by udontneed2knowme on Jul 27 2004.
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Morning Dreamer Resident Neo total posts: 2591 since: Sep 2001	Jul 28, 04 at 2:54pm ^ re: 3 odd facts
	No one lives for ever. You, I and everyone on neseeker and this world are going to die some day. Most likley, no one no this forum will live to see the year 2100. WW I was not very lng ago at all, and their are very few people left alive who remember it. The reason I took up science is because coming to spiritual conclusin based on anything but scientiffic facts is a spiritual game of Russian Roullet, and 4 years of DNS will do it to you. I am in the same situation with my mother, but I am wrried sick about her future as result. Looking out for your own spiritual well being doesn't guard your loved ones from the same threats, and self saturatin in cumfortable desires and Oasis will not save them, only blind them. This message was edited by Morning Dreamer on Jul 28 2004.
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superelitewarrior dangerous total posts: 158 since: Jul 2004	Jul 28, 04 at 3:06pm ^ re: 3 odd facts
	quote Morning Dreamer quote Then why are you saying there's a possibility the war never happened. BECAUSE THEIR IS. Can you PROVE to me that your pennies came from the war? Can your grandfather PROVE that he fought in the war? Can you PROVE that the war footage is not staged? Can you PROVE that the battleships actually saw combat, and that the bullet holes in the deck wern't put their to make it look like so? Can you PROVE that the ruins got that way through real war and not to make some movie or stage show? Can you PROVE that the people burried in military grave yards actually died in the war, and wern't civil homicide victims or victims of some other holacost? No! Is any of it LIKLEY, not at all, in fact, it's rediculous, but by the laws of science, it's possible, however unlikley, therefor, proof that WW II happened does not exist. Oh, and yes, you can not prove to me that you are a human being, and not some artaficial inteligence experimental machine. The odds are rediculous, but at the same time, you have no proof to show. Same here. I can't prove to you that I am not some artificial inteligence machine either. You nead to leave the weather or not alone. That's not what this is about. Focus on the difference between facts nd evidence. That's what it's all about. Weather or not WW II ever happened or weather or not your human or machine is not in question and is not an issue. Right now, you're sitting in the drivers seat, while i'me trying to get you to open the hood. Can u prove to me you exist? ------------------- well not much to say! But....
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Morning Dreamer Resident Neo total posts: 2591 since: Sep 2001	Jul 28, 04 at 3:11pm ^ re: 3 odd facts
	Nope.
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Dragon Cloud Neolithic since: Apr 2002	Jul 28, 04 at 3:14pm ^ re: 3 odd facts
	You can't prove anything. Like you said, Belief is more instinct. Belief is everything. Or you could go all BADAS AND HARDCORE and say " I think, therefore I am." ------------------- neosekkers are gay
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superelitewarrior dangerous total posts: 158 since: Jul 2004	Jul 28, 04 at 3:21pm ^ re: 3 odd facts
	quote Morning Dreamer Nope. Thats cool. you could be a giant galactic worm for all i know, which makes you cool. ------------------- well not much to say! But....
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udontneed2knowme Resident Neo total posts: 3120 since: Jun 2004	Jul 28, 04 at 4:14pm ^ re: 3 odd facts
	"Looking out for your own spiritual well being doesn't guard your loved ones from the same threats, and self saturatin in cumfortable desires and Oasis will not save them, only blind them." As far as being selfish and blind faith goes.. tell that to my mom.
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Fyrestorm Charged With Sexual Battery (moderator) Neo Emcee's Open Mic Neo-Duelist League The Arena The Graveyard The Legacy total posts: 12145 since: Sep 2003	Jul 28, 04 at 4:56pm ^ re: 3 odd facts
	My God, I can barely believe some intelligent posts have been made in here , well, after 11 pages I guess it was due to come around some more. Oh, and for udontneed2knowme, moliquiler or however its spelled isn't molecules, it just sounds similar, what it refers to is neither matter or energy, let me just dig up a quote of mine... quote Well, anyway, on the subject of this other entity, moliquiler did MD call it? So, the basic idea is there is matter and energy, two components that make up the universe, and they exist within four dimensions, so to truly exist, you must exist in all four, and to exist in time requires change, and all change is truly the movement of matter and/or energy, movement requires distance, which we have in the first three dimensions, and power, so for anything to exist time must occur, and for time to occur movement must take place, and for movement power and distance are needed, thus a source of power must exist, do I have this the right way up and such? There, that's the theory, or part of it anyway . ------------------- Words Are Weapons
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R3sistance Time + Rumor = Legend Neo or Bust total posts: 7702 since: Mar 2002	Jul 28, 04 at 6:12pm ^ re: 3 odd facts
	Ok just for the first point... I skipped over most of it but the 2 cities that were bombed by the nuclear bomb still have radation levels to prove that a nuclear bomb of the power it was and time it was, was dropped. The ammount of world war 2 left overs makes a point of what you can clearly state it did happen. LEGAL treatries from that time have signatures saying that Germany and Japan call a cease-fire and surrender from world war 2 did HAPPEN. these are enough points alone... their are hundreds of thousands. ------------------- Signature's FTL!... err... wait... ooohhh... too late -.-.
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superelitewarrior dangerous total posts: 158 since: Jul 2004	Jul 28, 04 at 6:20pm ^ re: 3 odd facts
	quote R3sistance Ok just for the first point... I skipped over most of it but the 2 cities that were bombed by the nuclear bomb still have radation levels to prove that a nuclear bomb of the power it was and time it was, was dropped. The ammount of world war 2 left overs makes a point of what you can clearly state it did happen. LEGAL treatries from that time have signatures saying that Germany and Japan call a cease-fire and surrender from world war 2 did HAPPEN. these are enough points alone... their are hundreds of thousands. ahh but you are passing on information you have seen or heard. But can you prove the treaty exists or that it is not some made up treaty. And those radiation levels might not even exist but some guy is telling us that they do. But can you actually prove that these radiation levels exist? ------------------- well not much to say! But....
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Morning Dreamer Resident Neo total posts: 2591 since: Sep 2001	Jul 28, 04 at 10:11pm ^ re: 3 odd facts
	quote There, that's the theory Yeah, but the soul aulturnative to that thery is that their are even smaller entities that make up their domane but for any entities, no matter how small and/or how much it goes on to be able to move or function, their has to be non-material distance and power. This actually excludes that thery as an aulturnative, but leaves it open as a possability within. This is a fact even with any theory of us being in some matrix dream world, since the exturnal universe it's generator would exist in has to still be made the same way.
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force God Among Clowns Seeketh Maximus since: Feb 2002	Dec 25, 05 at 6:16am ^ re: 3 odd facts
	intresting thread.... I'll post some of my "theories" I guess...of course they can be false or true...who knows...here ya go.. 1..america never landed on the moon 2..world maybe flat after all 3..time travel is possible 4..living forever could happen Im sure I'll get some know it all trying to disprove me...thats fine, but it will take lots of proof to change my mind also... ------------------- <gothic seductress> ahah I've been snorkeling once, fyi
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