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|Showing posts by Digerati in this thread (3 posts by Digerati out of 9 total posts in the thread)|
Oct 13, 12 at 7:53am ^re: Computer build and ordering components...
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There are some concerns, however.
I don't see a power supply listed. If the case's 650W ATX means that case comes with a 650W PSU, I would want something a little bigger - since you are putting in 32Gb of RAM and pretty serious graphics card. Plus, I would want to know the specifics of that 650.
I would recommend a "80-Plus Certified" 750 - 850W from a reputable maker.
That is a well build case, but I don't like tearing down my systems to lug them outside for internal cleaning. So I will never have a case without removable, washable air filters again. I line Antec cases for that, plus their included fans are top notch.
Note the terms of the Intel warranty for "boxed" retail versions of their CPUs that come supplied with an Intel cooler require you use the "accompanying thermal solution", or you violate the terms of the 3-year warranty. This is not a concern for many enthusiasts, and may not be for you. But it is something all builders (especially first timers) should know. The AMD Warranty, by the way, makes it crystal clear,
quote AMD WarrantyTo that, in spite of what many will tell you, the OEM supplied coolers from Intel (and AMD) are excellent coolers fully capable of keeping the CPU operating at a safe operating temperature - assuming of course, the case is doing its job of providing adequate front to back flow of cool air through the case, and the ambient (room) temperature is in the normal "creature comfort" range. I found this to be true, even with moderate overclocking. The downside to OEM coolers, IMO, is they are not quietest. Much better than a few years ago, but if using the computer in a home theater environment, any fan noise is too much.
If you are not concerned with maintaining a valid CPU warranty, then not a problem. It is not likely you will have any issues. But you never know, and I don't recommend omitting certain facts if seeking warranty support as that is fraud, a serious criminal offense.
Finally, I don't see an OS listed. Please note a common misunderstanding among many users is they assume they can use their old Windows license on a new computer, or with their upgraded motherboard. The fact is the vast majority of Windows licenses are NOT legally transferable. Only the "boxed" full Retail license can be transferred to a new computer (or upgraded motherboard). It is illegal to use an OEM/System Builders license that came with or was purchased for one computer on another computer. A disk “branded” with a computer maker’s brand name, or is labeled with “OEM", "OEM/System Builder”, “Upgrade”, “Academic Edition”, or "For Distribution with a new PC only", is not transferable to a new PC (or upgraded motherboard) under any circumstances. These OEM licenses are inextricably tied to the "original equipment". And most importantly, as users, we agreed to the terms of the end-user licensing agreement (EULA) when we decided to continue to use the software on the original computer. And that makes it legally binding.
With that in mind, if you need to buy a new license, with you getting more than 4Gb you will need to ensure you get a 64-bit OS and I recommend 64-bit Windows 7, or one of the many free Linux alternatives.
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Oct 13, 12 at 10:54am ^re: Computer build and ordering components...
quotePlease read what I said. I said OEM coolers are not the quietest. In fact I went on to say how folks replace them with quieter coolers in HTPC setups.
quoteThat is a blanket statement and like all blanket statements, it is wrong. Many aftermarket coolers are cheap knockoffs feeding off the false rumors spread that OEM coolers are bad. They are NOT bad. 10 years ago, maybe - but not today. Even when running at full speed, they are fairly (not the best) but fairly quiet - definitely quieter than many GPU coolers running full speed. Plus, today's CPUs are more efficient too and most generate less heat than those of yesteryear.
They have to be good - they are warrantied for 3 years where most aftermarket coolers are for 1 year, or even just 90 days. And cooler makers do NOT cover any damage (even if very rare) to the CPU.
Do NOT automatically use an aftermarket cooler based on unsubstantiated rumors. Try the OEM cooler first. Make sure your case is doing its job. Remember, the CPU cooler only has to toss the heat up into the air flow provided by the case, and the case must extract the heat from the interior.
If your temps are not controlled then, then consider an aftermarket cooler. But remember, motherboard designers cluster heat sensitive and heat generating devices (like the chipset and regulator circuits) around the CPU socket so they can take advantage of the EXPECTED OEM cooler's air movement. Side firing (and water) coolers do NOT provide that expected flow so "system" temps must be watched carefully if used.
quoteNo, but they can sure ask. And "because you won't get caught" is no excuse to commit fraud.
quotehiigaran is suggesting you deceive the CPU makers and Microsoft for personal gain. You can do that, lie to Microsoft or omit the truth. But understand that is fraud, a criminal offense, and in the case of software copyright infringements comes with potential fines of $250,000 plus 5 years in jail per incident. Your choice. There is no guarantee you will get away with it and certainly, he will not pay your fines.
Plus the Microsoft license agreement we all agree to when we first used the software makes it clear we can only transfer to a replacement motherboard during a repair with an identical motherboard from the same maker (or suggested replacement if original model is no longer in production).
I don't see the $100 for a legitimate OEM Windows 7 64-bit license too much in terms of costs, or to be legal.
I understand my comments are unpopular and go against common belief - but those are the facts anyway - and we agreed to them in our EULAs. Just because we won't likely get caught is no excuse to commit fraud.
quoteThe issue is, we don't know if it is a good quality PSU - thus my recommendation to get one from a reputable maker. Plus, while 650 is technically enough (1) it leaves little to no room for any future expansion - like another graphics card and (2) to use your own argument on noise, because it will be running much closer to capacity, the PSU's fan will be cranking at or near full speed much of the time - and being stuck to an exterior face of the case, make more noise than a bigger PSU that is loafing along.
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Oct 13, 12 at 12:39pm ^re: Computer build and ordering components...
quoteUmmm, sorry, but that is not true either. Most people correctly associate OEM with stock, "Original Equipment Manufacturer". And not aftermarket or non-stock.
quoteTo be sure, I have a nice monster Zalman in my HTPC. I have well over $5K in my home theater audio equipment alone. The last thing I want is to hear a fan rumbling during a quiet passage. But I put that fan on there, knowing, and accepting the consequences of "breaking the unit" of the CPU and supplied cooler, voiding the warranty and going with the Zalman.
I should point out that both AMD and Intel provide OEM versions of many of their CPUs without coolers, and for less money so you can, must, supply your own. But note those CPUs are warrantied for just one year, not three.
You say only a fool - that is an unfair statement! It assumes everyone (even those smart enough to ask questions first) has an understanding of coolers and cooling requirements when the vast majority of folks don't - and don't need to be. But to that, I frequently see $20 - $30 coolers being pushed - just because there are many (fools?) who automatically assume anything but the OEM cooler is better. Again - 10 years ago that might have been true. But not today.
quoteOnly the first part of that makes any sense. Sure, good is subjective. By "good", I mean they are well made, use quality precision bearings, provide the necessary cooling and are designed to last the life of the CPU when operated in all but extreme conditions. You say quality - quality denotes reliability and OEM fans (like the better models from the aftermarket makers you mention) are reliable.
quoteAgain, only half of that is right - if you do some heavy overclocking, you may need an aftermarket cooler. Hot and dusty places are up to the user and case cooling to deal with. Proper and or more frequent cleaning deals with heat trapping dust, not more cooling. Dust should never be allowed to accumulate to the point it significantly affects cooling.
quoteWhat can I say? I don't and you don't have the right to break the law or deceive another just because we don't have the money, or don't want to spend any more money. Especially for something not needed for me or my family's survival - like today's only meal.
quoteIt is there in black and white in the EULAs. You are allowed to replace anything, but the motherboard itself - unless an exact replacement as part of a repair action.
quoteReally? I mean I am not made of money but $100 for a brand new, 100% legal copy of Windows 7 seems pretty darn reasonable to me.
If that is too much money, don't steal! Use one of the free Linux alternatives. Two wrongs don't make it right.
quoteThey why keep at? And with me? You need to go argue with Microsoft, Intel and AMD if you don't like their use and warranty terms.
I am just saying as advisors, I think it important to warn someone if they might do something that is illegal, voids a warranty, or violates a "binding" agreement so they have ALL the necessary information needed to make an INFORMED decision. And I think it appropriate not to suggest to someone they do something that may void their warranty, or put them in legal consequences without at least warning them of those consequences too.
I'm just the messenger.
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