new computer / amd 1090t / asus crosshair iv

Forum Options:	my.neoforum register members prefs search faq

Topic: new computer / amd 1090t / asus crosshair iv Options: Print subscribe remove NeoPM
Threads List « Next Newest Next Oldest »
arachnophilia s-e-e-k-e-r total posts: 1811 since: Jul 2007	Feb 27, 11 at 12:37am ^ new computer / amd 1090t / asus crosshair iv
	Log in to remove this sponsored message okay, so, geek confession. i've never really built a computer before. not from scratch, anyways. i've swapped out all kinds of parts, and i have some basic working familiarity with the guts of a computer. i'm kind of a newb, but not totally. so, i'm gonna start by diving right in head first. my current computer is about to have its ten year birthday (yes, you read that right), so that should help inform my design choices. i'm going for as future-proof as possible. and because my current computer is ten years old, i have to start basically from scratch. everything is on its last legs or completely outdated or both. budget: around 2,000 USD, maximum. location: FL, USA. newegg looks like the way to go, but have a compusa close by for incidental need-this-part-now kind of stuff. purpose: insanity? photography (raw), multi-tasking/teh internets, and some gaming. but i'd like it to run games that come out years from now. i know this is going to be overkill, and i think i like it that way. multitasking: what's a lot? im client, firefox with a bunch of tabs, photoshop, raw converter, and files full of hi-res images. potentially web-surfing while gaming. games: oblivion/fallout 3, mass effect, dragon age 1/2. might let my brother use it for WoW. who knows, all kinds of stuff. resolution: have one monitor i'll likely run through DVI @ 1920x1080. have another i may or may not connect through DVI-DSUB @ 1280x1024. overclocking: almost certainly, but i'd like to get the build done and stable before i mess with that. aiming at air-cooling, though. peripherals: monitors, as above. speakers (stereo). that's more or less it. recycled parts: none. case: small. i don't have much room to fit it, and it's gotta fit where my old tower is now. that's about 19x11x20. length is flexible, height is not. RAM: oodles. aiming at 16gb. yes, i'm aware that's overkill. HDD: SSD system drive. 2x1TB HDD, in RAID 1 (backup). so, anyways, here's the specific hardware i'm looking at. case: cooler master HAF 912, decked out in 2x200mm fans, a 120mm rear fan, and a 140mm side fan, all red LEDs. i'd rather have a 912+, but they don't seem to be available in the US. this seems to be one of the few small cases that will actually fit a long video card on the inside, and fit the place i have to put it. mobo: asus crosshair iv formula. looked briefly at the "extreme" but didn't seem to justify the price. i highly doubt i'm going to need more than 2 video cards all operating at 16x. CPU: AMD 1090T. considered the new 1100T, but it seems to be the same processor with a higher price tag. better value from overclocking. CPU cooling: zalman 990 max (r). sticking with the red fan theme. GPU: sapphire 6970. considered flashing the 6950 up to 6970 (they're the same, just different firmware), but read of too many problems. not worth the potential danger. also considered getting 2 of a card that was half as good, and running in crossfire. PSU: cooler master silent pro 800W. want enough power to be flexible, so this should overshoot the system requirements slightly. RAM: g.skill 1600 16gb ripjaws x. this is, honestly, the bit i'm the most sketchy on, at the moment. the "non-x" version of these come highly recommended, and have a lot of flexibility in overclocking, and in the timings. there doesn't seem to be any real difference that i can tell between those and these, except for aesthetics (and the sandy bridge marketing). i think those heatsinks would look pretty awesome on the crosshair. i've considered getting 2 packs of 8gb (2x4gb), as it would be $50 cheaper, but i think i'm going to go with the "tested together" piece of mind. SSD: crucial c300 64gb. wouldn't a revo drive be cool, though? too bad it's obnoxiously hard to get it to boot on that mobo. i don't need space -- this is just for the OS and some programs. sata 6gb/s FTW. HDD: WD caviar black 1TB x2. I/O: LG combo drive. don't need to burn blu-rays, but watching them would be nice. I/O: rosewill card reader thingy. my camera, any pretty much any i would use in the future, uses CF cards. being able to connect them to my PC outside of the camera is a major time-saver. mouse: basic MS mouse because i don't care. got my parents that one many years ago, and it's still working great. keyboard: MS sidewinder 4. mostly for the backlit. OS: win7 ultimate (64). this is another place i'm sorta sketchy. i could save some money and just get home premium, but i sort of like the bitlocker idea. opinions? advice?
	quote quick quote edit quick edit del posts in thread report
Blue Neon Sla-nthra-llica dangerous total posts: 154 since: Apr 2008	Feb 27, 11 at 1:29am ^ re: new computer / amd 1090t / asus crosshair iv
	16Gb will be overkill for years no game recommends over 4gb and no game requires 2gb but you could get 4x3gb sticks for 12gb a bit better target,its double the considered amount which leaves plenty of headroom for years to come. 2 or 3 6970s in crossfire 900w psu minimum Do you 100% need to put the pc where you are going to? if not a haf 922 or 932 will keep it even cooler(i think). ------------------- Poseidon CPU:i7-2600k @ 4.3GHz RAM:16GB Kingston HyperX DDR3 Mobo:MSI P67A-GD53-B3 GPU:EVGA GTX570 HD SC Case:HAF-X HDD:240GB SSD, 3x HDD
	quote quick quote edit quick edit del posts in thread report
hiigaran Sajuuk awaits beyond the Gate of Balcora Elite Seeker total posts: 31971 since: Dec 2005	Feb 27, 11 at 1:30am ^ re: new computer / amd 1090t / asus crosshair iv
	for $2044.85: 2x HDD $54.99 x2 2x Video Card $324.99 x2 PSU $139.99 Keyboard $69.99 Mouse $14.99 Card Reader $14.99 RAM $109.99 Mobo $209.99 CPU $309.99 OS $179.99 BDD $49.99 i used a gamers keyboard because the one you linked is out of stock, and seeing as you want to game as well...why not? -------------------
	quote quick quote edit quick edit del posts in thread report
10jdrole Xbro gone postal total posts: 481 since: Oct 2007	Feb 27, 11 at 2:06am ^ re: new computer / amd 1090t / asus crosshair iv
	I have that thermaltake keyboard, and I highly recommend it. Keys feel great, the backlight works well, and the 10 programmable keys are nice. Also it appears that if you buy that video card in a combo (link), it'll cost about the same if the rebate still applies. You probably don't have a use for the laptop memory in the combo, but you could probably sell it online to save a little money. -------------------
	quote quick quote edit quick edit del posts in thread report
duneworld high on "N" total posts: 708 since: Aug 2009	Feb 27, 11 at 2:20am ^ re: new computer / amd 1090t / asus crosshair iv
	The 912 is a good choice of case. I believe the Neoseeker review showed that it competed quite well with it's bigger brothers in cooling terms and it is more feature rich. Another case that has similar dimensions to the 912 is the Zalman Z9, if that takes your fancy.
	quote quick quote edit quick edit del posts in thread report
arachnophilia s-e-e-k-e-r total posts: 1811 since: Jul 2007	Feb 27, 11 at 2:49am ^ re: new computer / amd 1090t / asus crosshair iv
	quote Blue Neon 16Gb will be overkill for years ... 2 or 3 6970s in crossfire 900w psu minimum is it better to go overkill on the GPU than the RAM? i was considering the insane amount of RAM primarily because gaming isn't really my main focus. rather, some very memory intensive graphics work: high resolution raw files, and lots of them. generally while doing other stuff, too. if gaming requires more GPU goodness, a second 6970 (and the PSU to run it) is an option i've considered as an upgrade down the line. as i understand it, even one of these cards will run just about anything out there today smoothly (crysis warhead @ 1920x1200 / 52 FPS, according to OCC), and two should be good for anything a year from now. quote Blue Neon Do you 100% need to put the pc where you are going to? unfortunately, yes. if space weren't limited, i'd definitely be looking at the 932 or the HAF X. quote hiigaran i used a gamers keyboard because the one you linked is out of stock, and seeing as you want to game as well...why not? thanks for your suggestions. any particular reason you favour an intel system? the CPU you suggest either is, or is very similar to the one i was eyeballing before i started looking into AMDs. the AMD is $100 cheaper, and has two more cores. i know there's a difference between intel and AMD clock ratings. but i'm going to push the 1090t up a bit anyways. supposedly, it overclocks to 3.7 effortlessly on that mobo (you literally just hit a button), and will get pretty close to 4.0 if you tweak it just right. i'm probably going to stick with the AMD/asus combo, unless there's a really good reason i shouldn't. is it the triple-channel RAM? you also seem to scrimp a bit in places i wouldn't, probably for the sake of doubling up on the video cards. i deal with a lot of data, and moving a few full 4gb CF cards from my camera to my computer may not be routine, but definitely happens. (imagine that over IDE and usb 1.1 for a second. it takes hours.) considering that gaming isn't really my main focus, do you recommend cutting down in some areas, to double up the GPU? for instance, dropping win7 ultimate down to home premium (-$80), going down to 8gb RAM (-$150), tossing the keyboard for now, in favor of a cheap generic (-$50). i don't know too many other places i'd really want to save. i'm kind of trying to balance flexibility, aesthetics, and sheer ass-kicking. edit: photoshop doesn't support crossfire or SLI. so i think i'll get more advantage out of putting my money into RAM.
	quote quick quote edit quick edit del posts in thread report
Blue Neon Sla-nthra-llica dangerous total posts: 154 since: Apr 2008	Feb 27, 11 at 10:21am ^ re: new computer / amd 1090t / asus crosshair iv
	you can still run crossfire but photoshop will only use one gpu ------------------- Poseidon CPU:i7-2600k @ 4.3GHz RAM:16GB Kingston HyperX DDR3 Mobo:MSI P67A-GD53-B3 GPU:EVGA GTX570 HD SC Case:HAF-X HDD:240GB SSD, 3x HDD
	quote quick quote edit quick edit del posts in thread report
hiigaran Sajuuk awaits beyond the Gate of Balcora Elite Seeker total posts: 31971 since: Dec 2005	Feb 27, 11 at 12:56pm ^ re: new computer / amd 1090t / asus crosshair iv
	quote if gaming requires more GPU goodness, a second 6970 (and the PSU to run it) is an option i've considered as an upgrade down the line. avoid the 6970. their performance to price ratio isnt as good as it used to be quote thanks for your suggestions. any particular reason you favour an intel system? their architecture allows for much better performance compared to an AMD chip. sure, AMD has better value, but AMD cannot compete with the performance of high end intel processors. and no, i am not biased wit hardware. quote the AMD is $100 cheaper, and has two more cores the problem is, you cannot compare them clock for clock or core for core. yes, the two extra cores are beneficial, but the higher performance from the intel architecture makes up for most of that loss. also, while i have no idea how true this is, ive read that intel chips perform slightly better with digital media applications. i have no idea why so dont take that as a point. i just thought i should mention it. quote is it the triple-channel RAM? thats one of the other benefits of this system. the higher memory bandwidth that comes from triple channel memory. this isnt a major plus, mind you. it just allows for faster loading and slightly improved digital media performance. gaming will remain unaffected as the performance changes arent that significant. quote you also seem to scrimp a bit in places i wouldn't, probably for the sake of doubling up on the video cards. i deal with a lot of data, and moving a few full 4gb CF cards from my camera to my computer may not be routine, but definitely happens. (imagine that over IDE and usb 1.1 for a second. it takes hours.) can you tell me where you think i have done that? all the choices i made were justified. the hard drives are cheaper, but they have the same space, and they are not of lower quality. people think that hitachi is a shit brand when you consider seagate and western digital, but let me ask you - how many times have you heard of a screw up from hitachi, as opposed to SG or WD? then there is the PSU. this was not cheaped out. i never cheap out on the PSU because doing so could mean disaster for your entire system. while blue neon said 900 watts minimum, he is wrong (no offense mate). if you look at the maximum power consumption of the video cards and CPU, then add a little more for everything else, the power needed is much less than you think. furthermore, the PSU comes with a gold efficiency rating, meaning that it is among the few good quality power supplies that will not lose as much energy to heat as other power supplies. this has no effect on performance, but it does have an effect on your electricity bill. even if you have a large budget, you can still employ some money saving techniques. quote considering that gaming isn't really my main focus, do you recommend cutting down in some areas, to double up the GPU? well you could do so and get a GTX 580, but i dont think it is worth it, as it is more expensive for the performance that it offers, as compared to the 570. the benefits of these cards is that your digital media programs can use them as an aid to take the strain off your CPU. of course, keeping in mind what blue neon said, you could still consider getting one video card instead which is more powerful, but the performance of a single 580 over a single 570 is not all that great. -------------------
	quote quick quote edit quick edit del posts in thread report
xchaosdragon666x Cloned Perfection mad messenger total posts: 295 since: Sep 2009	Feb 27, 11 at 1:59pm ^ re: new computer / amd 1090t / asus crosshair iv
	I only got one thing to say Gaming Mouse > Gaming Keyboard The mouse is more important than the keyboard Mouse expense adds DPI Keyboard expense adds backlit keys and a macro or two Mouse A better mouse gives you Higher DPI < Accuracy Adjustable sensitivity < From photoshop to FPS's this is a huge advantage from Sniping down to painting details Logitech MX 518 8 Buttons $37 ( had this mouse for about a year and a half and nothing but good things to say Works flawless on any surface and you will find your self using the extra buttons and adjustable sensitivity a lot more than you think) Keyboard (back-lit keys are only useful in dark rooms personally... i turn the light on or learn key locations like you were supposed to in the 3'rd grade) RAZER Arctosa Silver 104 Normal Keys $40 Never used this keyboard but Razer is one of the more popular brands to the gamer Total $78 ------------------- Current Gaming PC GPU: Radeon 4890 CPU: Amd Phenom x4 stock clock) Ram: Mushkin DDR3 1600mhz cas 7
	quote quick quote edit quick edit del posts in thread report
hiigaran Sajuuk awaits beyond the Gate of Balcora Elite Seeker total posts: 31971 since: Dec 2005	Feb 27, 11 at 2:11pm ^ re: new computer / amd 1090t / asus crosshair iv
	quote Mouse expense adds DPI DPI isnt all its cracked up to be. people think that the higher the DPI, the better it is. no. if you have too high a DPI, the slightest mouse movement will make your cursor move a lot. its similar to the settings in the control panel for mouse speed, but with one important difference. the DPI affects your precision. however, after a certain amount of DPI, this is not important. IMO, 800 DPI is enough, but hey, thats just me. i kick ass in halo...though COD4 not so much, considering my FPS is crap, but w/e -------------------
	quote quick quote edit quick edit del posts in thread report
xchaosdragon666x Cloned Perfection mad messenger total posts: 295 since: Sep 2009	Feb 27, 11 at 2:22pm ^ re: new computer / amd 1090t / asus crosshair iv
	quote hiigaran quote Mouse expense adds DPI DPI isnt all its cracked up to be. people think that the higher the DPI, the better it is. no. if you have too high a DPI, the slightest mouse movement will make your cursor move a lot. its similar to the settings in the control panel for mouse speed, but with one important difference. the DPI affects your precision. however, after a certain amount of DPI, this is not important. IMO, 800 DPI is enough, but hey, thats just me. i kick ass in halo...though COD4 not so much, considering my FPS is crap, but w/e with a higher dpi you do have to get used to it ill agree with that and above id say arround 1600 dpi is a waste you don't want to be slamming the mouse around to aim the goal is to be able to slightly move your wrist to turn arround But even if you do turn the mouses speed down it still maintains the precision with the option to go higher/lower and the logitech software lets you set DPI upper and lower limits but in film example a 30 sec clip 1600 fps vs 800 fps (yes this a good example) above a certain amount your eyes will stop caring but when it comes down to editing and slowing it down the 1600 fps will be an advantage but yes you do not need to overspend on the mouse but don't skimp with a M$ mouse For the TC this is something you should read before overspending on ram http://www.tomshardware.com/news/corsair-triple-channel-ddr3,6614.html But the trend continues and in gist focus more on quality than ammount and by quality i mean Timings followed by speed but can always lower the speed to get better timings Edit: Feb 27, 11 ------------------- Current Gaming PC GPU: Radeon 4890 CPU: Amd Phenom x4 stock clock) Ram: Mushkin DDR3 1600mhz cas 7
	quote quick quote edit quick edit del posts in thread report
hiigaran Sajuuk awaits beyond the Gate of Balcora Elite Seeker total posts: 31971 since: Dec 2005	Feb 27, 11 at 3:16pm ^ re: new computer / amd 1090t / asus crosshair iv
	quote but in film example a 30 sec clip 1600 fps vs 800 fps (yes this a good example) above a certain amount your eyes will stop caring but when it comes down to editing and slowing it down the 1600 fps will be an advantage umm...how does this relate? also, its above 60 FPS that you stop noticing any additional FPS. or were you talking about something else? quote For the TC this is something you should read before overspending on ram http://www.tomshardware.com/news/corsair-triple-channel-ddr3,6614.html you say TC, but all i see is performance differences in different amount of RAM, not the difference between DC and TC. also, OP is doing other things besides gaming, so 6 gigs should be a good amount to use. -------------------
	quote quick quote edit quick edit del posts in thread report
xchaosdragon666x Cloned Perfection mad messenger total posts: 295 since: Sep 2009	Feb 27, 11 at 4:14pm ^ re: new computer / amd 1090t / asus crosshair iv
	quote hiigaran umm...how does this relate? also, its above 60 FPS that you stop noticing any additional FPS. or were you talking about something else? I'm refering to polling rate with that example I.E. Response time quote hiigaran you say TC, but all i see is performance differences in different amount of RAM, not the difference between DC and TC. also, OP is doing other things besides gaming, so 6 gigs should be a good amount to use. Btw by TC I meant Topic Creator I can't find the correct page... for some reason... But the benchmarks of 3 vs 6 vs 12 is minuscule unless your playing a game while editing photos or playing a game in ridiculous resolutions like 2560 x 1600 which ATI Cards are better at due to higher amount of vram (off topic again...) Reason I said focus more on the latency than amount difference between 6gb and 12gb of ram even in editing was about a 1-3% difference only real difference was in winrar compression which increased its speed about 10% A lot like 3 video cards vs 2 the scaling isn't worth it 1 GTX 580 100% 2 GTX 580 30-70% increase depending on application 3 GTX 580 10% < it stops being worth it But that's for now later on programs will be designed to use it more efficiently i suppose But if you do intense amounts of multitasking i guess the higher amount of ram is worth it Edit: Feb 27, 11 ------------------- Current Gaming PC GPU: Radeon 4890 CPU: Amd Phenom x4 stock clock) Ram: Mushkin DDR3 1600mhz cas 7
	quote quick quote edit quick edit del posts in thread report
hiigaran Sajuuk awaits beyond the Gate of Balcora Elite Seeker total posts: 31971 since: Dec 2005	Feb 27, 11 at 6:15pm ^ re: new computer / amd 1090t / asus crosshair iv
	quote 2 GTX 580 30-70% increase depending on application what? those figures dont seem right. whats your source? quote But the benchmarks of 3 vs 6 vs 12 is minuscule unless your playing a game while editing photos or playing a game in ridiculous resolutions like 2560 x 1600 which ATI Cards are better at due to higher amount of vram (off topic again...) for multitasking, correct, but for games with high resolution, that is handled by the video card memory. thats why overclocking the card memory or getting a card with more memory (or both) is so beneficial to performance at those higher resolutions. -------------------
	quote quick quote edit quick edit del posts in thread report
arachnophilia s-e-e-k-e-r total posts: 1811 since: Jul 2007	Feb 27, 11 at 6:37pm ^ re: new computer / amd 1090t / asus crosshair iv
	quote hiigaran avoid the 6970. their performance to price ratio isnt as good as it used to be they're only slightly more expensive than the GTX 570's, and seem to perform better in the reviews i've read, especially at the resolution i plan to use. i have a 1080p monitor, and i plan to use it at 1080. quote hiigaran their architecture allows for much better performance compared to an AMD chip. sure, AMD has better value, but AMD cannot compete with the performance of high end intel processors. and no, i am not biased wit hardware. quote the AMD is $100 cheaper, and has two more cores the problem is, you cannot compare them clock for clock or core for core. yes, the two extra cores are beneficial, but the higher performance from the intel architecture makes up for most of that loss. also, while i have no idea how true this is, ive read that intel chips perform slightly better with digital media applications. i have no idea why so dont take that as a point. i just thought i should mention it. ...i'll look into it a bit. i'm reading several sources that say that photoshop etc is more optimized for intel. of course, the AMD upgrade path seems more stable. they don't seem to change their socket much, whereas intel does. quote hiigaran quote is it the triple-channel RAM? thats one of the other benefits of this system. the higher memory bandwidth that comes from triple channel memory. this isnt a major plus, mind you. it just allows for faster loading and slightly improved digital media performance. gaming will remain unaffected as the performance changes arent that significant. yeah, i read one or two reviews that didn't seem too impressed by it. of course, if i end up going intel, i'll definitely go that route. quote hiigaran quote you also seem to scrimp a bit in places i wouldn't, probably for the sake of doubling up on the video cards. can you tell me where you think i have done that? all the choices i made were justified. the hard drives are cheaper, but they have the same space, and they are not of lower quality. people think that hitachi is a shit brand when you consider seagate and western digital, but let me ask you - how many times have you heard of a screw up from hitachi, as opposed to SG or WD? oh, no, it's not that. it's that i'd really like 6gb/s on my data drives too. hitachi doesn't happen to make a sata3 1tb drive. i know this might seem like a little thing, and an area you could probably save -- but dealing with a few gigabytes of photos at a shot, i'll take all the speed i can get. of course, there aren't very many intel mobos with 3 or more sata3 connections... quote hiigaran then there is the PSU. this was not cheaped out. i never cheap out on the PSU because doing so could mean disaster for your entire system. while blue neon said 900 watts minimum, he is wrong (no offense mate). if you look at the maximum power consumption of the video cards and CPU, then add a little more for everything else, the power needed is much less than you think. furthermore, the PSU comes with a gold efficiency rating, meaning that it is among the few good quality power supplies that will not lose as much energy to heat as other power supplies. this has no effect on performance, but it does have an effect on your electricity bill. agreed. the one i picked was very much like that, just a different brand, and a little extra power, on the "just in case" principle. and black. quote hiigaran even if you have a large budget, you can still employ some money saving techniques. indeed. quote hiigaran well you could do so and get a GTX 580, but i dont think it is worth it, as it is more expensive for the performance that it offers, as compared to the 570. the benefits of these cards is that your digital media programs can use them as an aid to take the strain off your CPU. of course, keeping in mind what blue neon said, you could still consider getting one video card instead which is more powerful, but the performance of a single 580 over a single 570 is not all that great. i'm seeing that, for 2D graphic work, people are recommending more RAM over crossfire/SLI. multiple GPUs is clearly the way to go for gaming, but that's relatively low on my priority list.
	quote quick quote edit quick edit del posts in thread report
[All dates in (PST) time]	Threads List « Next Newest Next Oldest »

Thread title	From	Last replied
Now searching...

Hobbies

Sports

Skills

Chat and Lounges

Game Platforms

Mobile Platforms

Top Core Games

Top Portable Games

Top Communities