re: General religious debate thread - Page 17 - Thinker's Lounge

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Rondo In Eutopia, I sat. Far away... far away. Two much Neo total posts: 2463 neopoints: 1111 GameGrep pts: 1078 since: May 2008	Oct 31, 11 at 2:16am ^ re: General religious debate thread
	Log in to remove this sponsored message quote Styot Why simply trust that god means good when any normal appraisal of his actions tells you he's completely immoral? Because a deity is beyond our understanding. quote Styot You have to suspend you judgment and make a completely new set of rules or just say god can do what he likes, how ever bad it is it's not immoral. I refuse to make such exceptions. I'm not trying to persuade you. quote Styot As I said earlier God should at the VERY LEAST be able to attain an equal standard of morality as man, that means no murders. Why should God attain equal standard of morality of a man? And where are you getting a scale to say the 'very least'. -------------------
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D-G BANG CruisiN' total posts: 22184 since: Mar 2003	Oct 31, 11 at 2:19am ^ re: General religious debate thread
	He means that an omnipotent being doesn't need to kill people. There are infinite nonlethal alternatives when you're a being that can do literally anything. You're also only claiming that a deity is beyond our understanding. YHWH seems pretty human from what I read. After all, we're "made in his image", right? Since he doesn't have a physical body, that can only mean our minds are the same. -------------------
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Kedjown Gone slightly mad recently. ultra seeker total posts: 1486 since: Sep 2011	Oct 31, 11 at 2:22am ^ re: General religious debate thread
	quote TerraAbuser quote Kedjown (1.) I was asking was it wise for that passage to be included in the Bible? Because as you say, mankind (especially in the past two thousand years) has only had the Bible for religious teaching. Now, if I also were a religious lunatic, and I were, for example, the king of England, I could use that passage to kill in the name of God and (forgot the word - short term memory loss again) make everything seem lovely. Which many people in the past have, and many people in the present still do. To sum up: Millions, possibly billions, of people killed thanks to misinterpreted (?) Bible scriptures, with apparently no deity diving in to prevent this. How could such a superior, omniscient being not have foreseen this? And don't say he "left us with a choice", because that's influence at it's utmost. Why are you asking me questions ment for God? Ask him. I don't know EVERYTHING, lol. I'm not kidding, if you want the answer so bad, prey for it, the Holy Spirit will tell you, SOMETHING. That just isn't gonna happen. I live in the real world, where I expect answers for my questions; I don't just expect to live without knowing any answers, to accept that "God works in mysterious ways". It took a while, and I fully expected this answer from you. The answer ultimately being, "I have no idea, pray for answers". Praying never directly got anything done, unless you count people believing that God stepped in, when there are perfectly rational answers; eg someone praying that their child will do well at school, and they do. Praise the Lord! Bullshit. ------------------- Don’t cry because it’s over, smile because it happened. - Dr. Seuss
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TerraAbuser threadnought total posts: 619 since: Aug 2011	Oct 31, 11 at 2:22am ^ re: General religious debate thread
	quote DG No, I keep asking the same questions because you fail to answer them properly. I require logical answers, not simply "God can do what he likes." The hell is a Burra? Some kind of insult? And no, it is not a poem. What on earth are you talking about? The Bible is a collection of stories by various authors. Also letters and other types of document, in the new testament. The one thing it does not contain is poetry. I have answered them properly! Its you who have failed to comprehend! It does not matter what you think you require! God has given everything that you require! You just refuse to accept his word as fact. You think him a liar and a murderer. You do not trust in him, nor believe he exists. He has been standing RIGHT IN FRONT OF YOU with his arms wude open, and still you cannot even see him! Lol, Burra = I'm mad! lol IT DOES CONTAIN POETRY!! >:'O BURRA!! Read Psalms! ITS ALL POETRY YOU NUTTER!! >X'O BURRRRRRRRRAAAAAAAAA!!! (Okay this time I'm definatly out... unless...)
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Styot Gott mit uns Neo or Bust total posts: 7240 since: Feb 2007	Oct 31, 11 at 2:25am ^ re: General religious debate thread
	quote Rondo Because a deity is beyond our understanding. Ok it's beyond our understanding, but why dose that automatically mean we should we trust that a deity is good or even benevolent and not immoral? quote Rondo Why should God attain equal standard of morality of a man? And where are you getting a scale to say the 'very least'. Because the Christian god is supposed to be PERFECT and omnipotent, and in pretty much any other concept of God he is of a higher power and higher plane of existence then man. Seriously, if man can work out murder and slaver are wrong surely God must be able to. You don't think God would be capable of attaining the same standards as mortal men? -------------------
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D-G BANG CruisiN' total posts: 22184 since: Mar 2003	Oct 31, 11 at 2:28am ^ re: General religious debate thread
	¬¬ Fine, doesn't contain poetry APART from the Psalms. If those really are poetry as such. They're not what I usually think of as poems. Well now, why would I accept the word of a supposedly omnipotent being who never seems to use his omnipotent powers? Why would I accept the word of someone who isn't even talking to me? I cannot. For I cannot hear him. And why would I trust the words of a known mass murderer, anyway? -------------------
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TerraAbuser threadnought total posts: 619 since: Aug 2011	Oct 31, 11 at 2:29am ^ re: General religious debate thread
	(Unless this happens! BURRA!! lol) quote Kedjown That just isn't gonna happen. Thats your decision. I'll just say this POETICALLY (oh no, will they get it?) One can't see without seeing. One can't hear without hearing. One can't believe without believing.
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TerraAbuser threadnought total posts: 619 since: Aug 2011	Oct 31, 11 at 2:39am ^ re: General religious debate thread
	quote Styot Because the Christian god is supposed to be PERFECT and omnipotent, and in pretty much any other concept of God he is of a higher power and higher plane of existence then man. Seriously, if man can work out murder and slaver are wrong surely God must be able to. You don't think God would be capable of attaining the same standards as mortal men? God is perfect. Thus he does no wrong. You don't know what perfect is! Therefore, how can you judge correctly? 9.99999999999999999999(infinatly) times out of ten, you will get it wrong. You think all killing is murder? Than why do you continue to eat? Even if your a vegitarian, your still killing to survive. Thus, if you truely believe all killing is murder than shouldn't you ought stop eating alltogether? Yet you continue to eat! And somehow you think God is a murderer for killing organic child bodies that he created in the first place in order to save MANY, MANY more children that those slaves procreated later on and taught to follow God? BURRA! YOU THINK GOOD TO BE EVIL AND EVIL TO BE GOOD! BURRA!! >:'O lol
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Kedjown Gone slightly mad recently. ultra seeker total posts: 1486 since: Sep 2011	Oct 31, 11 at 2:45am ^ re: General religious debate thread
	quote TerraAbuser Even if your a vegitarian, your still killing to survive. Thus, if you truely believe all killing is murder than shouldn't you ought stop eating alltogether? Yet you continue to eat! And somehow you think God is a murderer for killing organic child bodies that he created in the first place in order to save MANY, MANY more children that those slaves procreated later on and taught to follow God? It's not against the commandments to kill anything other than a human being. Hell, Peter was a fisherman. God clearly broke his own rule. ------------------- Don’t cry because it’s over, smile because it happened. - Dr. Seuss
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TerraAbuser threadnought total posts: 619 since: Aug 2011	Oct 31, 11 at 2:46am ^ re: General religious debate thread
	quote DG ¬¬ Fine, doesn't contain poetry APART from the Psalms. If those really are poetry as such. They're not what I usually think of as poems. Well now, why would I accept the word of a supposedly omnipotent being who never seems to use his omnipotent powers? Why would I accept the word of someone who isn't even talking to me? I cannot. For I cannot hear him. And why would I trust the words of a known mass murderer, anyway? Well I'm not here to try to convince ya (even though I have tried on occasion, lol.) It comes down to what we, "Christians" believe. Some do take it all literally, yet I see many parables and things written poetically. Example: When the Bible seys he made us from the "dust of the ground." Does this mean that he LITTERALY sculpted us from the soft earth with physical hands? What are we made of: Carbon. What is the earth made of: Carbon. I believe that is what he is saying. Y'all just need to THINK MOAR!!
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TerraAbuser threadnought total posts: 619 since: Aug 2011	Oct 31, 11 at 2:52am ^ re: General religious debate thread
	quote Kedjown quote TerraAbuser Even if your a vegitarian, your still killing to survive. Thus, if you truely believe all killing is murder than shouldn't you ought stop eating alltogether? Yet you continue to eat! And somehow you think God is a murderer for killing organic child bodies that he created in the first place in order to save MANY, MANY more children that those slaves procreated later on and taught to follow God? It's not against the commandments to kill anything other than a human being. Hell, Peter was a fisherman. God clearly broke his own rule. If God did not "kill anyone" or, as I would say, "allow anyone to be killed" than NO ONE WOULD EVER "DIE!" Our bodies NEED to be able to "die." Otherwise, we'd be stuck or this small planet infinatly reproducing and destroy our own planet due to over population. Then we'd be floating through outer space STILL UNABLE TO "DIE." What kinda joy could be in us then, huh?
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Rondo In Eutopia, I sat. Far away... far away. Two much Neo total posts: 2463 neopoints: 1111 GameGrep pts: 1078 since: May 2008	Oct 31, 11 at 2:53am ^ re: General religious debate thread
	quote Styot quote Rondo Because a deity is beyond our understanding. Ok it's beyond our understanding, but why dose that automatically mean we should we trust that a deity is good or even benevolent and not immoral? Because God claims it. Why should you believe him? I honestly can't think of a logical explanation to that. Like I said, I'm not trying to persuade you. quote Styot quote Rondo Why should God attain equal standard of morality of a man? And where are you getting a scale to say the 'very least'. Because the Christian god is supposed to be PERFECT and omnipotent, and in pretty much any other concept of God he is of a higher power and higher plane of existence then man. Seriously, if man can work out murder and slaver are wrong surely God must be able to. You don't think God would be capable of attaining the same standards as mortal men? I really don't understand what you're trying to say. -------------------
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Suzaku_Firebird Casting all the hate upon oneself. Hooked on Neo since: Apr 2010	Oct 31, 11 at 3:09am ^ re: General religious debate thread
	Just got one thing here-Terra, you stated that God supposedly created us good but we were corrupted. Riddle me this, if God supposedly created us in his image(not physically, once again), that would mean he took aspects from his mind. Thus he created us able to be corruped. He created us with the ability to turn into rapists, murderers, pedophiles, etc. And considering he based us off himself, that would mean he can be corrupted. You can say he is perfect and such cannot be corrupted, yet if we were made in his image, we would be perfect and unable to be corrupted. ------------------- quote People are stupid, they will believe something because they want it to be true; or because they're afraid it might be true. quote The only sovereign you can allow to rule you is reason.
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Kedjown Gone slightly mad recently. ultra seeker total posts: 1486 since: Sep 2011	Oct 31, 11 at 3:22am ^ re: General religious debate thread
	quote TerraAbuser quote Kedjown quote TerraAbuser Even if your a vegitarian, your still killing to survive. Thus, if you truely believe all killing is murder than shouldn't you ought stop eating alltogether? Yet you continue to eat! And somehow you think God is a murderer for killing organic child bodies that he created in the first place in order to save MANY, MANY more children that those slaves procreated later on and taught to follow God? It's not against the commandments to kill anything other than a human being. Hell, Peter was a fisherman. God clearly broke his own rule. If God did not "kill anyone" or, as I would say, "allow anyone to be killed" than NO ONE WOULD EVER "DIE!" Our bodies NEED to be able to "die." Otherwise, we'd be stuck or this small planet infinatly reproducing and destroy our own planet due to over population. Then we'd be floating through outer space STILL UNABLE TO "DIE." What kinda joy could be in us then, huh? Wow, just... wow. So you're saying we can only die if we are killed? You know what, it's not even worth debating with you anymore. ------------------- Don’t cry because it’s over, smile because it happened. - Dr. Seuss
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Rondo In Eutopia, I sat. Far away... far away. Two much Neo total posts: 2463 neopoints: 1111 GameGrep pts: 1078 since: May 2008	Oct 31, 11 at 4:45am ^ re: General religious debate thread
	quote DG He means that an omnipotent being doesn't need to kill people. There are infinite nonlethal alternatives when you're a being that can do literally anything. You're also only claiming that a deity is beyond our understanding. YHWH seems pretty human from what I read. After all, we're "made in his image", right? Since he doesn't have a physical body, that can only mean our minds are the same. Yeah, the only thing I'm claiming is that he is beyond our understanding. I can't back anything else up. I agree that there are probably many other alternative. Probably a lot more humane alternative would seem nicer to us. But being beyond our understanding there could be reasons that we can't comprehend. We're made in his image, but that doesnt mean an exact copy. It could mean that he is in a much larger scale than us. -------------------
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General religious debate thread - Page 17

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